are electric cars ahead of their time.

Started by alfred, March 20, 2022, 07:53:13 AM

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alfred

I say this because although electric cars its seemed are the future of travel, but because of a hold up in the electronic parts,  these cars cant operate ,and so used cars are in great demand as a result,

in recent times the idea of not having either petrol or diesel cars on the road new or other wise will create more chaos as the manufacturers decide the best way to go forward ,as it is for the moment were in grid lock,

so with all this planning could we see petrol and diesel cars back on the roads for a very long time,  whilst  the manufacturers try to decide the best way forward,


as it is with the so called electric cars  where are all the power points going to be set up, on high streets , or back roads, where if possible ?? so if people with an electric car need to top up their car ,  where and if how is this going to happen, where will they find a charging point, ??


i cant seeing people charging up their electric cars from home especially as both gas and electric fees are about to go through the roof , so where else could these charging points going to be , and at what price to fully charge a car ,


so is this a step too far, and too soon, as at some time in the future both oil and petrol will go into decline as the world runs out of natural resources, and an alternative will have to be found hence the electric car,


Q; do you have any thoughts on how this might end , if so will you share your thoughts with us,




Michael Rolls

Yes - the speed with which the government are trying to rush this through is idiotic. There was a very interesting article in the Telegraph three or four weeks ago - I mentioned it in another thread. Three ladies. all keen to save the planet by going electric, were loaned an electric car each for a week. At the end of teh week all three had revised their position to -'perhaps one day'. A further horror story - couple decided their tatty old Land Rover was due for replacement so they bought an electric Jag, with whihc they had nothing but trouble. The one long journey they undertook, to friends, was carefully planned - but when they got there, expecting to top up the battery whilst visiting, they found nobody had a cable long enough to reach the car. The battery still had enough charge to reach a filling station where there was a queue of the points, so after two hours they finally got to a charger only to discover that the car refused to charge. Luckily, there was a Jaguar agency nearby who managed to charge it for them. Despite all their careful planning, they got home five hours later than expected.
I have no doubt that there will be many such instances to come - oh - and they got rid of the Jag and replaced it with a fossil fuel car!
There is also the question of cost - electric cars are much more expensive than normal cars- Vauxhall's cheapest electric is some £26k - the petrol version is £16k. My hybrid Mondeo was £5k more expensive than the petrol version - which isn't made any longer. OK, it does 48 to the gallon instead of 32, but even at today's inflated prices, that's over five years of petrol - and health, etc., permitting, I don't expect to keep it that long.
Mike
Thank you for the days, the days you gave me
[email protected]

klondike

The availability of computer chips is holding up production of all cars not just electric ones.
Problems I see with electric cars for many are..

High initial cost.

Cost and life expectancy of the batteries. Who wants 10 year old car that will need a new set of batteries costing thousands of pounds in a short time. Many current cars on the road are 15 or 20 years old these days. I'd guess at a maximum life of 12 years for electric and they will be scrap. Most less than that.

Batteries need rare and expensive materials to produce. So far as I know they cannot be recycled efficiently.

You need to be able to recharge at home and that is impossible with much of the current housing stock.

Limited mileage.

Can the electrical grid cope? Not just total supply but can the street cabling handle the current?  Charging an electric car is at least 50kwh and more for one with any sensible range.

How will HMG replace fuel duty?

That said my son bought one last December to replace his Land Rover Discovery as filling that up was getting to be silly money. Even sillier money now. Now he has had his home charger fitted it is completely practical.

It's good to moan.

Michael Rolls

Any ideal how much it costs him to 'fill the tank'? For £75 or so (doubtless more soon) I get a range of 550 miles - that's with a non plug in hybrid so no charging needs
Mike
Thank you for the days, the days you gave me
[email protected]

klondike

His car has the 72kwh long range battery which they optimistically claim can give up to 298 miles. On his current fuel fix which runs quite a time I think he said he pays 12p a unit overnight so a fill up costs less than £10. He bought one of these which are currently like hens teeth but he got lucky as the local dealer had just had one in and he grabbed it.

https://www.hyundai.co.uk/new-cars/ioniq5

It does display how many miles you are getting per kwH but that varies depending on speed and temperature and I can't recall what it was saying. He reckons his fuel bill will be about a quarter what it was with the Disco.

It's good to moan.

Raven

As I have said for a long time now.........I have no interest whatsoever in Electric Cars, :nooo: I don't want one and I won't get one. :angry:
As far as I'm concerned the longer petrol/diesel cars are around the better.  :yahoo:

FLOUNCER3

ignoring the cars, what about lorries and busses?
we all remember the trolley busses, but that was just around town
what about the busses that go to the outlying places..
and what about Ravens tractor, or will they require a few more Clydesdales
and what about the HGV's
or is it ok for some to pollute... :Help:

klondike

Can't use Clydesdales. Too much methane production for us to meet the targets I fear.  :grin:

The moritorium on petrol/diesel from 2030 is new cars only. At least I think it is. Half of an HGV's load would be the batteries.

It's good to moan.

klondike

Quote from: Raven on March 20, 2022, 11:21:55 AM
As I have said for a long time now.........I have no interest whatsoever in Electric Cars, :nooo: I don't want one and I won't get one.
They are the correct choice for some and the wrong choice for others. I think for my son it was the correct choice as the limitations don't impact him and overall he saves a lot of money. More since fuel prices have started to skyrocket.

What I think is a very big mistake is pushing forward with compulsion on this with so many problems apparently unsolved and the fact that whatever we do in this little country will have no impact on any problems the planet may or may not face from man made greenhouse gas production.

It's good to moan.

Alex

I don't fancy an electric car, I couldn't afford one anyway so I'll carry on chugging along with my 15 year old Fiesta.  I think Alfred is right  " a step too far and too soon"

Scrumpy




I too will chug along in my old motor..


I know this is stupid.. But lightning worries me.. :nooo:
Don't ask me.. I know nuffink..

Alex

Would wearing a tin foil hat help Scrumpy ? :cool:

Michael Rolls

Quote from: klondike on March 20, 2022, 10:26:11 AM
His car has the 72kwh long range battery which they optimistically claim can give up to 298 miles. On his current fuel fix which runs quite a time I think he said he pays 12p a unit overnight so a fill up costs less than £10. He bought one of these which are currently like hens teeth but he got lucky as the local dealer had just had one in and he grabbed it.

https://www.hyundai.co.uk/new-cars/ioniq5

It does display how many miles you are getting per kwH but that varies depending on speed and temperature and I can't recall what it was saying. He reckons his fuel bill will be about a quarter what it was with the Disco.
What did he have to pay for the car compared to a fossil fuel of similar spec? 'Filling the tank' isn't the only cost. As I mentioned my hybrid cost £5k more than the petrol version [no longer made!]
Mike
Thank you for the days, the days you gave me
[email protected]

FLOUNCER3

and when the electric prices go all the way up perhaps the savings might not seem so great

klondike

Quote from: Michael Rolls on March 20, 2022, 03:46:58 PM
What did he have to pay for the car compared to a fossil fuel of similar spec? 'Filling the tank' isn't the only cost. As I mentioned my hybrid cost £5k more than the petrol version [no longer made!]
It was somewhere north of £40k. He had the Disco on hire but they are over £60k new. He bought the electric one with a guaranteed buyback price after 4 years @ 18k miles a year of £17k so it costs somewhere over £5k per year.

Quote from: FLOUNCER3 on March 20, 2022, 04:16:51 PM
and when the electric prices go all the way up perhaps the savings might not seem so great
Electric is going up because all fuels are going up. There has been a big leap in diesel prices just recently. Apparently 40% of our diesel is refined in Russia. I imagine that the cost ratio will remain broadly the same. The biggest part of car fuel costs is tax which you escape with electric.

I'm not an advocate of electric cars but if the costs work out better for somebody they'd be daft not to take one. I won't because my mileage these days is so low I'm more likely to go for an electric mobility scooter rather than another car of any sort. Anyway an electric car here is impossible as there is no dedicated parking so all charging would have to be at public charge points. Five minutes to fill up with petrol is acceptable but a couple of hours to while away as an electric car charges isn't. Plus fast chargers are expensive compared to using home electric.

It's good to moan.