She would have probably had a worse punishment if she had been kept out of prison and everyone knew where she lived.

I an totally, utterly appalled

Quote from: Alex on January 26, 2024, 08:37:16 PMThanks for making that clearer Cass.  I assume this person will arrive up here at Ashworth Hospital, all the bad beggars end up here.  One good thing nobody has ever escaped from Ashworth.

Correct he's going to Ashworth 

Quote from: Diasi on January 27, 2024, 07:02:33 PMWell I can't think of a more appropriate sentence than whole life in prison.

As it stands, this black waste-of space got an indefinite hospital order which can be lifted at any time so he could be out at some point on the nod of a couple of gullible dimwit psychiatrists.

Not quite, as I explained Justice Turner handed down sentencing to Calocane under sections 37 and 41 of The Mental Health Act 2007. Section 37 allows reviews periodically by panels of psychologists etc but the decision for release is made by senior politicians, ie the Home Secretary or his Tribunals, not a 'parole board' of left leaning appeasers.

He was also sentenced under section 41 (as explained). Since the 2007 amendments to the Mental Health Act 1983, 'restriction orders' under section 41 are indefinite. If patients are conditionally discharged from hospital, these restrictions continue under section 42 of the Act.

Again, an "absolute discharge" can only be given by the secretary of state or tribunal.

This outcome is extremely unlikely. Mira Hindley was sentenced to 3 whole life tariffs for murder in April '66. She appealed for release in 1998. The Appeal Court judges upheld the decision by the then Home Secretary Jack Straw that Hindley should stay in prison until she died.

The supremely dangerous lunatic that is Calocane was intelligently sentenced to avoid the advantage to him of never ending reviews by the likes of loopy Lord Longfords, who thought Hindley had transmogrified into the reincarnation of 'Mother Theresa'. Today, such starters for ten could perhaps materialise in left wing Tories, the Lib-dems, most Labour MP's and the entire readership of 'The Guardian' attempting to 'proxy' similar minded people onto the personnel of future 'parole boards' and releasing Calocane to murder anew.

He will serve his term in a high security hospital, like Broadmoor, where Ronnie Kray spent his last days and never escaped in 26 years. The term will very likely be for life in reality, as Justice Turner intended. As I mentioned before no Home Secretary would dare to release him, when it's his neck alone that carries the responsibility for going against the vast majority of citizens, who would I suspect to have preferred the death sentence?

Because of 'mens rea' it could be dangerous to sentence those who commit crimes whilst the balance of the mind is disturbed. Who knows they could recover to full cognisance over time in care? However for cases where DNA and or video evidence, or say multi witnesses places guilt beyond doubt, I would be in favour of returning the death penalty.

Irregardless though in a world where the next Prime Minister (an ex senior lawyer) cannot even define what a woman is ~ the prospects of that materialising are never going to happen ...

Interesting post.

Thanks Cass.  One would have thought that should someone ever fully recover from what led them to kill then they would be in the paradoxical situation of realising that his/her actions were so heinous that he/she wouldn't want to be released.

I.e....only a lunatic would want parole.

Quote from: dextrous63 on January 28, 2024, 05:33:40 PMThanks Cass.  One would have thought that should someone ever fully recover from what led them to kill then they would be in the paradoxical situation of realising that his/her actions were so heinous that he/she wouldn't want to be released.

I.e....only a lunatic would want parole.

Yes I know from Brady's defence (Hindley's fellow Moors assassin) that over the course of time he never wanted release and so didn't appeal. He came to realise he was dangerous so he said. However I can assure you from personal experience many 'old lags' find existing outside the prison regime vety difficult. For instance one of my 'reliable, repeat business clients' once broke into my home and I found him in the kitchen on a Sunday morning cooking my breakfast, having 'broken in' overnight, even my dog knew him well enough to give him a welcome and was sitting on his lap! Finishing the washing up he implored me to ring the local nick to report him for the offence, keen to return to his old home "before they let my room out mate". He spent half his life in jail and following the death of his wife had nothing outside to compete with his time as a resident at 'Ford' Open Prison. When I declined he said -

"Oh please sir, give the Bill a ring, I don't want to frighten any old girls, or get me head beaten in or blown orf", I felt sure you'd help me out, I only wanna get back!"

Poor chap.  One would wish that more crooks could reflect on people like him and live within the law in order that his cell wouldn't be needed for someone else and he could thus remain inside 🤭😬

He returned after I defended him for 'stealing' silverware, very badly! The Judge who was well known to us both, dutifully did his part and he returned to his beloved cell/room a week or so later. This time he got extra time for persistence etc. It was good enough to see his time out. He left me a rather beautiful pocket watch and gold double chain with a seal. His solicitor (a smoker) a classic lighter. He'd had both engraved. They read ...

Remember me, when this you see and bear me in your mind
Let all the world say what it may
But speak of me as you find ...

Lovely.  Pity they were stolen goods, but it's the thought that counts😬😬😬

Quote from: Cassandra on January 28, 2024, 05:15:58 PMNot quite, as I explained Justice Turner handed down sentencing to Calocane under sections 37 and 41 of The Mental Health Act 2007. Section 37 allows reviews periodically by panels of psychologists etc but the decision for release is made by senior politicians, ie the Home Secretary or his Tribunals, not a 'parole board' of left leaning appeasers.

On the other hand, going by our recent Home Secretaries and other politicians, who knows?  😮

Very interesting about Brady, too.  Such decisions would benefit everyone else as well.

Cassandra, if it wasn't so serious, the image of him cooking you breakfast and having your dog on his lap would be hilarious

Quote from: dextrous63 on January 28, 2024, 07:00:15 PMLovely.  Pity they were stolen goods, but it's the thought that counts😬😬😬

 That's my first laugh of the day..

That's quite sad I find myself feeling a bit sorry for him.   

Quote from: Michael Rolls on January 29, 2024, 05:55:36 AMCassandra, if it wasn't so serious, the image of him cooking you breakfast and having your dog on his lap would be hilarious

I had to laugh myself, I can still see it vividly to this day and thankfully I do have a sense of the ridiculous. It was a scene straight from the 'Goon Show'! The chap in question could have been played perfectly by the actor 'Freddie Jones'. Yes he was a thief, but all my animals were extremely fond of him. He specialised in National Trust Properties or Museums, not liking to upset 'privates' with sensitive dispositions by stealing their sentimental items. He was also a 'melter', ie everything was instantly reduced in his oven in the cellar to weighted gold or silver. This particular 'bent' also made it hard for the 'old bill' to gather specific evidence against his activities! He came from a good family, his father was a 'right honourable'. Once I had to dispose / 're-home' his 5 Greyhounds following my failure to prevent another elongated term in the jug! I was more successful at this activity (they all went to private domestic homes) than I had been as his advocate. I should add both the 'gifts' he left were family heirlooms, with providence to prove it .