North Korea and Nuclear warning

[JBR]

They are both following the accords of 'The Minsk Agreement of 2014', which the Ukrainian leaders signed and have since chosen to ignore. Kiev was once the capital of Russia. Upon the establishment of the USSR in 1917 following the Revoloution of the same year, it was decided that Kiev as a centre would administer the regions, now under dispute.  Russia wants her territories that were administered from Kiev in the Communist years (1917 - 1999) returned to The Russian Federation following Ukraine's decision to seccede, post Gorbachov. Walensky wants to hang on to these areas, which were never part of The Ukraine. Unfortunately the other side of the story is never told as it is by the Western media.

He doesn't want much, does he?
Those areas would include Poland, much of East Europe and, of course, East Germany!

I can foresee Putin retaining the south-eastern parts of Ukraine and, of course, Crimea which is the area he really wants.  On the other hand, America will not be happy for him to keep Crimea as that gives him control over the Black Sea.

I'm also surprised that Putin isn't making every effort to regain Finland and the Baltic States but, of course, all of those countries are now part of NATO.  I sometimes think that Ukraine should have joined NATO at the start when he had a chance, but decided to remain independent on the assumption that Putin would stick to the agreement.  Putin is certainly not to be trusted.

Incidentally, I see on the news this morning that Zelenski is talking with TwoTier.  I couldn't help but shout out to him not to trust that bugger for a second.

[Cassandra]

Ahhhh, thanks

Sometimes the price of perfection is too high, sorry

[Cassandra]

He doesn't want much, does he?
Those areas would include Poland, much of East Europe and, of course, East Germany!

I can foresee Putin retaining the south-eastern parts of Ukraine and, of course, Crimea which is the area he really wants.  On the other hand, America will not be happy for him to keep Crimea as that gives him control over the Black Sea.

I'm also surprised that Putin isn't making every effort to regain Finland and the Baltic States but, of course, all of those countries are now part of NATO.  I sometimes think that Ukraine should have joined NATO at the start when he had a chance, but decided to remain independent on the assumption that Putin would stick to the agreement.  Putin is certainly not to be trusted.

Incidentally, I see on the news this morning that Zelenski is talking with TwoTier.  I couldn't help but shout out to him not to trust that bugger for a second.

No thats Historically incorrect. For the sake of clarity see the map below showing the disputed territory. Also Putin applied for Russia to join Nato, post Perestroika but was rejected.

[klondike]

They are in the bits between those areas too. 

[Cassandra]

They are in the bits between those areas too.

Its believed Putin would drop insistence upon other parts and I would expect that is known.

[JBR]

No thats Historically incorrect. For the sake of clarity see the map below showing the disputed territory. Also Putin applied for Russia to join Nato, post Perestroika but was rejected.

Well, I believe that the two provinces adjacent to the Sea of Azov are also now held by Russia.

What I didn't know was what you said about Putin applying to join NATO!  I find that ridiculous, as the main reason for NATO being founded was to protect us against the threat of Russian expansion.  If he did, I'm sure he must have been rejected as no-one can trust him.

[Cassandra]

Well, I believe that the two provinces adjacent to the Sea of Azov are also now held by Russia.

What I didn't know was what you said about Putin applying to join NATO!  I find that ridiculous, as the main reason for NATO being founded was to protect us against the threat of Russian expansion.  If he did, I'm sure he must have been rejected as no-one can trust him.

JB, firstly reference the heading of this thread:-

The Sea of Azov territories you refer to are Zaporizhzhia Oblast and Kerson. Which prior to 1917 were also part of Russia too. I suggested Putin may be prepared to relinquish these in my post before.

I attach the link reference Russia joining Nato.

https://www.rferl.org/a/russia-putin-says-discussed-joining-nato-with-clinton/28526757.html

In closure ... This war will have to end before 100s of 000's of more pitiful young men on either side die in mindless needlessness, as begets so many human conflicts ...

Then a more personal reflection, which has shown up herein from others, not yourself I hasten to add, with whom I have enjoyed exchanging views and opinions. I now feel clumsy for posting some of my stories over here to an audience, that contains the barely disguised cynacism to what today was clearly an obvious typo upon my behalf. A thinly veiled sarcasm to an occurence I have experienced many times myself on this platform and reacted benignly to in every instance. Such things are age and in some cases believe me, heath related corrollaries. The 'other place', breeds such critique and sarcasm and was the main reason I left it.

The words spoken so well in the closing scene of 'Bladerunner' by the synthetic human Roy Batty, played by Rutger Hauer are perhaps more relevant now for my consideration ... they commence with ~ "I've seen things you've never dreamed... and end poignantly ~'Time to Die'.

[klondike]

This war will have to end before 100s of 000's of more pitiful young men on either side die in mindless needlessness, as begets so many human conflicts ...

Pity the invasion preceded any negotiations on those disputed territories which nowhere to my knowledge has recognised legitimately belong to Russia.

[Cassandra]

Pity the invasion preceded any negotiations on those disputed territories which nowhere to my knowledge has recognised legitimately belong to Russia.

It's impossible to find anything that expresses the Russian side of the argument in the entirety of the Western media.

[JBR]

Thank you, Cass, for the article regarding Russia's attempt to join NATO.  On reflection, I wonder whether the 'expansion' of NATO (which was done in my opinion due to the fear of Russian expansion) might have begun to worry Putin to the extent that he may have thought that joining NATO would have been a safe means of preventing the expansion into his 'empire' by neighbouring countries!

I agree that this war should come to an end and, of course, although Russia is losing men hand over fist, Ukraine is not without its own losses.  The real question is, where should the new borders be drawn?  
I can appreciate that the south-eastern provinces of Ukraine house majority Russian people, so at least some of those might permanently join Russia - upon the agreement of a majority of their people.
Crimea is another matter, as it is a very important location for control of the Black Sea.

If and when this is all over, Ukraine certainly should join NATO for its future protection, simply because you can't trust the Russians!  After all, they walked into Ukraine and Crimea without any leave or discussion.