Liz Truss on Sturgeon

Started by Alex, August 02, 2022, 01:00:42 PM

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Ashy

I can see the only way to settle this is to fight.

Raven

Because what English MPs want they get, every time an SNP member gets up to say anything he is immediately jeered at, shouted down, sniggered at. It's disgusting behaviour by people who hate the Scots being there. I see it every time the chamber is on the News. They want Scotland to shut up, get back in the box, and do as we are told. It's been going on for centuries and it's going to stop.
Even on here today I read I'm part of a misguided electorate.
I'm not misguided at all, I knew exactly what I was voting for.

Ashy

Perhaps we should have a referendum on whether to hold a referendum.

When I saw the scale of the SNP's victory I couldn't really see how Westminster could deny them a referendum on independence, but they did agree at the time that it was once and for a generation.

Now we have the precedent of the Donbass declaring themselves independent.

Raven

#18
Quote from: Ashy on August 02, 2022, 10:43:44 PMPerhaps we should have a referendum on whether to hold a referendum.

When I saw the scale of the SNP's victory I couldn't really see how Westminster could deny them a referendum on independence, but they did agree at the time that it was once and for a generation.

Now we have the precedent of the Donbass declaring themselves independent.


The reason things changed and the SNP wanted another vote is because they were lied to.
They were promised we would be saying in the EU, next thing the Tories went back on their word and took us out.
I also have personal experience of the lies. My mother was in Sheltered housing at the time and the tenants got a visit in the lounge from the Tory councillors. They didn't expect to be challenged on their lies but I was not going to sit there and listen to them scaring the older pensioners. When they said all their pensions would be stopped if we left I had had enough, and stood up and called him a bloody liar to his face.
He blustered and stammered as I raved at him and suddenly he remembered an appointment. Yes I hate the Tories with every fibre of my being and I'm not afraid to say it or call them out, but they only have their invited audiences at their wee TV questions, they are too scared of people who challenge them and ask awkward questions, how I would love to go to one of their shows.


August 02, 2022, 11:13:10 PM
Anyway I have said enough, more than enough. These type of Threads get me angry and upset so I will now bow out.

GrannyMac

Scotland should have its referendum, pay for it, and accept its outcome as final. With roughly the same population as Yorkshire, it does pretty well out of UK funds as a whole, so money can't be the main driver. Perhaps if I still lived there I wouldn't see the bigger picture, and feel hard done to.

I actually think Sturgeon & Co should be looking at a very big issue, the high numbers of drug related deaths.  The highest in Europe by far. Probably the fault of the Tories....

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-58024296
Its not how old you are, but how you are old. 💖

Raven

Actually GM I agree with you, personally I don't think this is the right time, too much else is needed to be done. But they were elected on a 2nd ref promise and she has to honour that promise. I also think she will have been put under pressure to do it.

Diasi

#21
Quote from: Cassandra on August 02, 2022, 03:46:05 PMI have no idea. If Scotland became independent, the Tories would gain an extra majority of 59 seats overnight at Westminster, almost certainly committing both Starmer and Labour to the dust bin of History. Same time clearing England of a huge deficit and open up a bargaining tool with Sturgeon's beloved EU to re-negotiate the N.I. border with.

In likelihood the EU won't want another hungry mouth to underwrite and would the SNP press ahead for a Nationwide decision; with no Barnett formula and higher recovery costs on ever deeper North Sea Oil seams as a medley? Conversely for them the SNP would have a massive majority in the new administration and Sturgeon could choose to ignore the ideological Green party.

At least both sides could say post-split, it was Scotland's call to vote and if it came to it, their choice to secede?

I think Truss is intelligently appealing to an increasing swell of English people who now want separation for the reasons above. After all sadly but clearly there is now a mutually expanding distrust between the Nation peoples and maybe surgery is the only way forward for both viewpoints to co-exist in a batter way in the future?

Why not let Scotland have a referendum whenever they choose - every other month if so desired, let them be proactive about this - England can't lose? Perhaps a ballot in England (in which all the Scot ex pats could vote) as to Scottish separation would be a good idea? At least to gage how the other half feel and give them a chance to respond to Sturgeon's disappointing, but understandably strategic insults every few weeks, which are increasing tiresome to endure.

I've long said we should get rid of this irksome little backwater for the reasons you have outlined.

Scotland has a similar population to the individual populations of 75% of the English regions & only around half the population of London.

Scotland's capital, Edinburgh, has a smaller population than Sheffield, which isn't even the capital city of an English region.

Talk about the tail that wants to wag the dog.
Make every day count, each day is precious.
"Death leaves a heartache no one can heal, love leaves a memory no one can steal".  (Cassandra)

Scrumpy

Quote from: Ashy on August 02, 2022, 10:38:58 PMI can see the only way to settle this is to fight.

I agree... I will be armed with my pitchfork..  They don't like it up 'em. :waiting: :waiting:
Don't ask me.. I know nuffink..

klondike

Quote from: Raven on August 02, 2022, 11:29:20 PMthey were elected on a 2nd ref promise 
She may as well have promised a Scottish moon landing. You can't promise something that isn't actually in your power to grant.

As I said I believe they should be given another referendum.  As many referendums as they want come to that. One every week if they choose but they should be paid for by extra Scottish income tax which is something she does have the power to control.

We live in a time when intelligent people are silenced so that stupid people won't be offended

Michael Rolls

And income tax in Scotland  is already higher than in the rest of the UK
Thank you for the days, the days you gave me
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klondike

As I said she has the power to raise extra income tax already. 

We live in a time when intelligent people are silenced so that stupid people won't be offended

Michael Rolls

The 2014 referendum cost the Scottish taxpayer £15.85 million. Scotland raises £13 billion p.a. in income tax, so the total take would only need to raise by 0.12%. 2,500,000 Scots pay income tax and, of course, the amount individuals pay varies widely. I doubt an extra 1p in the pound would be needed.
Thank you for the days, the days you gave me
[email protected]

Alex

I just don't understand why the Scots on social media are up in arms about Truss's comments.  She said Sturgeon is an attention seeker.  She didn't say the Scottish nation are attention seekers.   :wtf:

Jacqueline

Why can't we have a Referendum on immigration in the high numbers that we have now?  Essential immigrants only i.e. doctors and nurses, NOT fruit pickers, barbers or Pakistani rapists. And instant deportation on any foreign criminals and undesirables.

Ashy

Why don't we vote for the parties that offer us just those things?