Ukraine ?

[Alex]

Are we the baddies? What if the Ukraine war is just as stupid and wrong as the Iraq war, but the state propaganda has been more successful and hardly anybody has realised... yet?'
These are the thoughts of Peter Kitchens, a Marmite figure for sure.   He has a point though.

[klondike]

I don't think there are any goodies in that one. Putin felt threatened but it wasn't Ukraine doing the threatening. Looks like it will drag on and on possibly for years. I don't see any solution. 

[Ashy]

I don't think we should have got involved in this one.

[Raven]

I don't understand why we get involved in any of the East's Wars. They are none of our business and it brings us nothing but trouble. Terrorism ect

[JBR]

Ukraine made the mistake of trusting Russia.
I understand that the original agreement was that Ukraine (like Belarus) would not join NATO and remain independent from both that and Russia, if it would be left alone.
Obviously, Putin couldn't restrain his expansion hopes and decided to grab Crimea and now the eastern parts of Ukraine.
Perhaps Ukraine should have seen what was coming and applied to join NATO right at the beginning.

[Cassandra]

Ukraine are the most 'bent' regime in the world, even ahead of Pakistan and could never have been accepted by NATO and certainly not now as they are at War. Reading 'The Minsk Agreement(s)' explains the history of the argument.

The West has insisted on encroaching further and further towards Russia by extending the EU, just as they did throughout the early sixties with nukes in Turkey. The culmination then was the 'Cuban Missile Crisis' and the nearest to date we have come to WW3.

It costs each UK taxpayer or consumer of utilities between £150 to £500 a month extra to support the War.

[JBR]

Ukraine are the most 'bent' regime in the world, even ahead of Pakistan and could never have been accepted by NATO and certainly not now as they are at War. Reading 'The Minsk Agreement(s)' explains the history of the argument.

The West has insisted on encroaching further and further towards Russia by extending the EU, just as they did throughout the early sixties with nukes in Turkey. The culmination then was the 'Cuban Missile Crisis' and the nearest to date we have come to WW3.

It costs each UK taxpayer or consumer of utilities between £150 to £500 a month extra to support the War.

You are perfectly correct regarding NATO encroaching further toward Russia.
What are your feelings about Finland joining NATO?

The Baltic states are already immediately adjacent to Russia, and Poland next to Belarus.
If Ukraine loses half of its country and what remains applies to join NATO, do you think they'll be accepted?

[klondike]

Only if the war stops and I imagine not joining NATO will be one of the terms agreed to end it.

[JBR]

Only if the war stops and I imagine not joining NATO will be one of the terms agreed to end it.

So that Russia can regroup and complete the job in a few years!

Hang on.  Isn't that what they agreed before: don't join NATO and we'll leave you alone?

[klondike]

Plus give us all the nukes there from the Soviet Union days. Yes that about sums it up.

Doesn't mean it won't happen again.