'The quotes were £5,000 or more': electric vehicle owners face soaring insurance costs(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/fd24248d0e128a2dd2af55182413bf8a03701665/0_491_8192_4918/master/8192.jpg?width=620&dpr=2&s=none)
Driving an electric car should be a win-win, saving money and the planet. So David* was shocked when the insurance on his Tesla Model Y came up for renewal, and Aviva refused to cover him again, while several other brands turned him away.When David did secure a new deal, the annual cost rocketed from £1,200 to more than £5,000."My insurer was Aviva from July 2022 to July 2023, but when it was coming up for renewal, I received a letter stating that they would not be covering the Tesla Model Y any more," David says. "I am a member of a Tesla UK owners forum, and lots of other people seem to be having the same issue."In the Facebook group, members share stories of horror renewal quotes, with increases ranging from 60% (up to £1,100) to a staggering 940% (a jump from £447 to £4,661, according to a screengrab shared by one driver)."I spent weeks on every comparison site as well as trying individual insurers and specialist brokers, but either they wouldn't cover the car or the quotes were £5,000 or more," says David, whose only change in circumstance was three points on a licence.Privilege, Vitality, Axa and the specialist broker Adrian Flux were among the brands he found were "unable to insure him at this time" before he nailed down a policy with Direct Line, albeit at a price."The best quote I could get was from Direct Line at £4,500," he says, adding that the total cost exceeded £5,000 once the interest for paying monthly was included, "because who has got that kind of money in one go?"Read more : https://www.theguardian.com/money/2023/sep/30/the-quotes-were-5000-or-more-electric-vehicle-owners-face-soaring-insurance-costs
hopefully, this will help stop the advice of these stuoid bloody devices!
Reading through the whole article confirms what I thought, it's the cost of repairs that make virtually all EVs write-offs in the case of any impact that causes chassis damage which will obliterated the £10,000 battery.
The initial insurance cost of £1,200 should have been enough of a red flag to stop him buying it.
I wonder how long it will be before ALL owners of EVs sell them off for as much as they can get for them.
Another fine idea of the government, scuttled by practicalities and common sense.
Well, they've put off 2030 until 2035 in their desperation. I wonder what they'll do next.
Gas-powered cars? Elastic band-powered cars? Pedal cars?
Quote from: JBR on October 01, 2023, 04:10:59 PMI wonder how long it will be before ALL owners of EVs sell them off for as much as they can get for them.
Another fine idea of the government, scuttled by practicalities and common sense.
Well, they've put off 2030 until 2035 in their desperation. I wonder what they'll do next.
Gas-powered cars? Elastic band-powered cars? Pedal cars?
And all to save 1% of the world's total pollution emissions.
I honestly despair at the sheer arrogant stupidity of the UK's climate change morons.
me too
I think our politicians are leading us up a blind alley and they are too stupid to know.
As I said on the football mystery though - follow the money. There is a lot in it for those providing a home for the wind turbines and those operating them. Certainly enough to use a portion of it to persuade our politicians what a great idea they are.
Quote from: klondike on October 01, 2023, 07:03:02 PMAs I said on the football mystery though - follow the money. There is a lot in it for those providing a home for the wind turbines and those operating them. Certainly enough to use a portion of it to persuade our politicians what a great idea they are.
Sadly you're spot on, but anyone who looks at your banner or the National Grid: Live programme can see what an absolute crock it is.
There's a hardly a day where renewables aren't the minority generating types.
Over here one chap in town was not amused when his Tesla 'sunk' through his 12 year old screen blocked driveway up to it's axles. They are double the weight of a normal car and being mostly small wheel based, the burden of distribution has the same effect as Stiletto heels on soft flooring. Also if they catch fire (which happens not infrequently) they burn intensely and are most difficult to extinguish. Some Green newbies who bought with their hearts and not their heads are learning first hand the frightening cost of battery replacement as a capital item. They are worth bugger all secondhand too as most stateside vehicles cover much higher average mileages than the UK, so their faults on short range and re-charging have been exposed far faster. They eat tyres and suspension springs too.
Many States are considering higher excise duties as they wreck roads, bridges, multi-story car parks etc, as well as their owners pockets. Personally I think they have all the crossed appeal of several hundred flash lights powering as oversized bathroom accessories.
Unfortunately you have Grant 'Herr flick' Schapps and Caroline 'Greeny' Nokes with about 259 other vegan wets masquerading as Tories who seem obsessed with the damn things ...
Quote from: Cassandra on October 01, 2023, 08:43:14 PMOver here one chap in town was not amused when his Tesla 'sunk' through his 12 year old screen blocked driveway up to it's axles. They are double the weight of a normal car and being mostly small wheel based, the burden of distribution has the same effect as Stiletto heels on soft flooring. Also if they catch fire (which happens not infrequently) they burn intensely and are most difficult to extinguish. Some Green newbies who bought with their hearts and not their heads are learning first hand the frightening cost of battery replacement as a capital item. They are worth bugger all secondhand too as most stateside vehicles cover much higher average mileages than the UK, so their faults on short range and re-charging have been exposed far faster. They eat tyres and suspension springs too.
Many States are considering higher excise duties as they wreck roads, bridges, multi-story car parks etc, as well as their owners pockets. Personally I think they have all the crossed appeal of several hundred flash lights powering as oversized bathroom accessories.
Unfortunately you have Grant 'Herr flick' Schapps and Caroline 'Greeny' Nokes with about 259 other vegan wets masquerading as Tories who seem obsessed with the damn things ...
Thankfully, most of those Tesla lovers, although being loaded with money are proportionately lacking in common sense.
Actually, if they have enough money to burn without even noticing it, they'll probably continue to 'invest' in Teslas and look down on us thinking they're more intelligent than the rest of us.
No wonder Musk wants to get the hell off the planet before people realise he's been selling the emperor's new clothes.
I got a watch with a step counter about a month back. It encouraged me to take a walk eaxh day, This is not a very affluent area and on my walk I've noticed lots of quite old cars. There are plenty from around 2005 and even some older ones. I doubt there will ever be 18 year old EVs still in use unless there are some big life expectancy improvements with the batteries along with reduced prices. A 12 year old car is worth maybe £1000 or less and a £500 repair being neeeded would probably lead to it being scrapped so the chance of any old car getting a £10k battery replacemeny is pretty much zero.
I've mentioned it before, but it may have not been seen by all on this thread. Letter in the paper, must be two or three months ago. Chap needed a new battery for his Tesla - £16,000! Many folk can't afford that for a car, never mind a sodding battery. Shocked at the price he managed to get a reconditioned one (whatever that means) for a mere £10,000.
I suspect reconditioned means one rebuilt from intact cells from damaged ones. That is just a guess.
Quote from: klondike on October 02, 2023, 07:19:34 AMI suspect reconditioned means one rebuilt from intact cells from damaged ones. That is just a guess.
Yes, correct.
Most Tesla batteries contain 7,104 individual 18650 lithium batteries, which are the type commonly used with a rechargeable LED torch, assembled into bigger blocks.
While each of the individual 18650 cells won't be replaceable the blocks of them can be replaced.
Just go onto Amazon & work out how much 7,104 18650 batteries will cost at an individual level.
A man(ufacturer) said on the radio last week that they hope to have the grail of solid state batteries in production by 2030. This will pretty much change everything in terms of charge times, cost, etc etc. I suspect this may partly be why Rishi deferred the dates.
We'll have to wait & see.
Batteries have improved no end. There are now tiny LiPo batteries of huge capacity for their weight. They do have one snag of course - the propensity to burst into flames at the slightest provocation.
The older lithium-ion ones are a better but there is a reason Royal Mail say they can't be posted and why anything with one in has a great big hazard label on the box.
Quote from: klondike on October 02, 2023, 08:27:16 AMBatteries have improved no end. There are now tiny LiPo batteries of huge capacity for their weight. They do have one snag of course - the propensity to burst into flames at the slightest provocation.
The older lithium-ion ones are a better but there is a reason Royal Mail say they can't be posted and why anything with one in has a great big hazard label on the box.
Yes, as I found out when I bought an external alarm sounder direct from China & it arrived minus it's rechargeable lithium backup battery, which meant it couldn't fulfill it's intended purpose.
The problem with lithium polymer batteries is the very small number of recharges they can have.
No matter how much the scientists piss about with battery development they've not yet succeeded in developing one that can do everything better than an ICE engine can do.
The problem with lithium polymer batteries is the very small number of recharges they can have.
I didn't know that. Is it because they've caught fire after just a few?
seems a reasonable guess
Given all these advances in battery technology, why are ICE batteries still heavy old clunking things?🤷🏻�♂️
because they're relatively cheap?
You'd have thought that there'd be equally as cheap smaller/lighter batteries by now. After all, they weigh around the same as a wheel, and we're all well aware how many new cars don't have a spare as standard for fuel cost cutting purposes.
Quote from: klondike on October 02, 2023, 09:25:08 AMThe problem with lithium polymer batteries is the very small number of recharges they can have.
I didn't know that. Is it because they've caught fire after just a few?
They have a recharge limit of around 300 times.
From what I've read about them they seem to be used mainly by drone flyers & other RC device users.
October 03, 2023, 06:39:35 AMQuote from: dextrous63 on October 03, 2023, 05:24:11 AMGiven all these advances in battery technology, why are ICE batteries still heavy old clunking things?🤷🏻�♂️
Probably because a Lithium battery going into thermal runaway next to a petrol or diesel engine in a vehicle wouldn't be very good.
Apparently some motorcycles have them as the fire risk is probably deemed to be low risk, until it goes up in a shed or garage.
Good point Diasi. I was going to suggest putting the battery in the boot, but as this would most likely be in close proximity to the fuel tank....😬😳
the boot of my Mondeo contains both the 'big' battery (and I mean BIG) for the motor and the normal battery - which looks a bit smaller the the battery of my previous, petrol Mondeo - whish was under the bonnet as usual
I was keeping my electric bike in the house but decided that outside was safer. I'll see how long the cover lasts and if it isn't long enough I'll clear out some space in the summer house for it.
Quote from: Michael Rolls on October 03, 2023, 09:12:02 AMthe boot of my Mondeo contains both the 'big' battery (and I mean BIG) for the motor and the normal battery - which looks a bit smaller the the battery of my previous, petrol Mondeo - whish was under the bonnet as usual
What about the shopping ? :smiley:
There's more bad news, Petrol Ped did a caravan towing test & BMW lent him their top-of the-range EV with the largest capacity battery on the market, but once it was towing a caravan the range dropped by 60% from around 300 miles to around 120 miles.
Plus to charge the car the caravan would have to be uncoupled &, apart from a motorway services, left outside on the road as there wouldn't be room at the charge points.
Quote from: Diasi on October 03, 2023, 05:54:03 PMThere's more bad news, Petrol Ped did a caravan towing test & BMW lent him their top-of the-range EV with the largest capacity battery on the market, but once it was towing a caravan the range dropped by 60% from around 300 miles to around 120 miles.
Plus to charge the car the caravan would have to be uncoupled &, apart from a motorway services, left outside on the road as there wouldn't be room at the charge points.
Yet more reason why I shall avoid electric cars as long as I live!
Actually, I'm sure that popular support for them will dwindle up to and beyond the government's hopeful ICE cut-off date now of 2035, apart possible for little local run-abouts.
welll, another nice mess they've got us into!
October 03, 2023, 07:33:34 PMQuote from: Alex on October 03, 2023, 05:15:20 PMWhat about the shopping ? :smiley:
I don't shop - I get Tesco to deliver. The amount of space the motor battery takes up in the boot would make the Mondeo impractical for a family of four going on holiday - they would need a rooftop box
LPG cars have a similar problem. I don't think they ever really caught on here but they were quite popular in Europe some time ago. Might even be now - I've lost contact.