Another Tony Martin?

[klondike]

It's time this crap stopped. Another elderly farmer facing a gang of burglars picks up a gun and defends himself then ends up with a possible murder charge.

'BOTCHED BURGLARY' Suspected burglar, 19, 'shot dead during break-in at remote farmhouse' – as farmer arrested on suspicion of murder

A FARMER has been arrested on suspicion of murder after a suspected burglar was shot dead at his remote farmhouse.

Marcus Smith, 19, was discovered dead at the scene in Whaley Bridge, Derbyshire, yesterday morning.

Police had been called to reports of a break-in when they found the footballer.

A second teen was also found with gunshot wounds nearby and remains in hospital with serious injuries.

He has been arrested on suspicion of aggravated burglary, along with a fourth man, aged in his 20s, who was held a few hours later after a van he was travelling in was stopped by police on the A6.

The farmer, aged in his 50s, is being quizzed on suspicion of murder and attempted murder and remains in custody.

The dad-of-four has been described as a private-school educated churchgoer.

Marcus, who leaves behind two brothers, used to play for Macclesfield Town FC.

A family member said his devastated mum Kerry, a nurse, was "grieving for her son".

Paying tribute on social media, a friend said: "I love you more than life. RIP."

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/27687183/suspected-burglar-shot-dead-break-in-farmer-arrest/

To my mind one less scumbag in the world and another who may have second thoughts in future. They must have been fairly close for a shotgun to bring them down and I doubt he'd have hit two with a rifle.

[muddy]

Best not to try and rob a farmer they tend to have a gun handy .

[Scrumpy]

If these people want to break in and steal what is not theirs they should take whatever is coming to them..
I think everyone has a right to protect themselves and their property..
Shoot first..   
The thieves could be carrying knives/ guns..

I wouldn't put my life at risk by politely asking 'Are you armed'? 

[GrannyMac]

Agreed. Was he expected to let them take what they wanted and perhaps put his family at risk?

[Scrumpy]

I bet you anything you like the papers will be full of people saying how wonderful Marcus Smith was.. 
That he didn't deserve to die..
He was loved by all and always ready to help others..

How the farmer was a bully.. and had a quick temper..

[Alex]

Here we go again !  poor young footballer, he wasn't a footballer he was a thief, or a would be thief. 

[klondike]

Yes scumbags for sure. I just hope for the sake of the farmer that they weren't scumbags who were running away. I'd hop it quick if somebody was waving a shotgun at me. At close range they can make a pretty big hole.

[muddy]

I don't understand why he is being charged with murder as opposed to manslaughter .
He surely didn't plan to murder anyone ? 

[Mups]

I don't understand why he is being charged with murder as opposed to manslaughter .
He surely didn't plan to murder anyone ?

Yes.  Quite.
But the break in was intentional though,  wasn't it.   

No one just happens to break into someone's property by accident!

[klondike]

To be fair to the police letting rip with a shotgun at somebody if unjustified is murder if you kill them.  The legal question in the UK is whether appropriate force was used. If he was in fear of his life which may well have been the case then he was justified in shooting them. If they had turned and were running away he wasn't.

I own shotguns. I don't think I'd ever actually discharge one at somebody if I wasn't absolutely sure it was them or me. It would bugger up the carpet and walls for starters....

[Diasi]

I've studied the part of the law which covers self-defence in considerable detail.

It's another sloppily written piece of legislation that isn't fit for purpose.

Basically it allows a person, normally a householder in their own home for this thread, to use whatever force, including lethal force, they consider to be necessary at the time.

It also states that the person does not have to wait to be physically attacked before defending themselves, they're allowed to use force to prevent what they deem to be an impending attack.

That should be the end of it but then we have the police & the courts deciding & ruling on whether what we thought was reasonable.

[Michael Rolls]

here we go again - I STILL think Tony Martin suffered a miscarriage of justice - and this guy had to defend himself against four scumbags

[Mups]

To be fair to the police letting rip with a shotgun at somebody if unjustified is murder if you kill them.  The legal question in the UK is whether appropriate force was used. If he was in fear of his life which may well have been the case then he was justified in shooting them. If they had turned and were running away he wasn't.

I own shotguns. I don't think I'd ever actually discharge one at somebody if I wasn't absolutely sure it was them or me. It would bugger up the carpet and walls for starters....

That's just it though.  How could anyone be absolutely sure?

If several men broke into our home and started threatening us,  we are hardly likely to ask whether they mean it or not - especially if they have a weapon of some sort.

I am inclined to agree with Michael  (above),  this man was entitled to defend himself.

[Diasi]

here we go again - I STILL think Tony Martin suffered a miscarriage of justice - and this guy had to defend himself against four scumbags

It was a definite miscarriage of justice & some of the evidence against him, in my opinion, perverted the course of justice.

The prosecution, aided by so-called experts, alleged that Tony Martin deliberately fired as the two burglars were trying to leave his house.

However, the true facts, borne out by numerous local people & close friends, show that his house had only one room with lighting which was his bedroom & the only room he used.

As he came down the stairs in total darkness he would hear the burglars but most certainly could not have seen where they were or what they were doing & wouldn't have known whether he'd hit anyone or not.

[Michael Rolls]

my feelings exactly